Jaruzelski with a very clear idea, with the certainty that Poland has turned a page, that the time of struggle and confrontation among us is over, and that a new period — undoubtedly a still more difficult one - is opening up. It is the era of dialogue to build the future of our society.
We know that Solidarnosc has won a great political victory, but we would be irresponsible if we rested on our laurels.
The hardest road, both for us and for the government, remains ahead. And I am not sure if I did the right thing in changing methods. The future will tell whether I was wrong.
• Would the round-table's success have been possible without the moderating role of the Church? Will this role be sufficient to guarantee the continuation of the democratization process?
It has to be remembered that in Poland there is a perfect symbiosis, unique in the world, between the society and the Catholic Church.
This is why the relations between Solidarnosc and the bishops become tighter in difficult moments, but the union movement retains its indepen-
### ZLOTYCH dence. We are neither right nor left, neither too linked to the Church nor insensitive to its advice. We are simply something different. But we know that without the help of the Church we would not have managed to fight on and resist for so many years. Polish society as a whole might have given in, if it had not been guided by the words of the Pope and his bishops. At certain times, I can assure you, the round-table resembled a boxing ring. The Church played the role of referee, a referee who proved capable of assuring victory for both of the contending parties. • Do you think that the great political reform outlined in these last days in Warsaw is irreversible?
That is precisely our concern. But I must tell you right away that the answer to that depends on both of us, on the Poles as well as you in the West. We must not fail, we must not betray the spirit and the letter of the social pact that we have signed. That would be a catastrophe. But for the moment, I cannot see the conditions for this. It is you, the great Western democracies, that have to understand that an unparalleled historic opportunity has been created in Poland.
I will strive to explain to the Italian. political leaders and unions that it is not up to us to guarantee the final victory, because we have won it, regardless. The problem is to shorten the road that has to be travelled, to reduce the number of obstacles, to manage a smooth transition from a system that recognizes its bankruptcy to a freer and more just Poland closer to Europe. It is to achieve this end that we need aid, both economic and political, but also advice about how to make a democracy work. • Do you think that the Polish turn would have come about without Gorbachev and Gorbachevism? If you went to Moscow to meet the 7 Kremlin chief, what would you tell
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Interview with Lech Walesa "Poland has turned a page"